Curse

Dr Dimento · Mar 03, 2008, 04:13 AM // 04:13

I'm currently progressing through Nightfall with my monk, so i can't test this properly until i get a nice high Sunspear rank...

Bonder Monk
Mo/N
16 Protection Prayers
15 Divine Favor
The rest in blood magic
All Radiant Insignias/Attunement Runes

[skill]Life Bond[/skill][skill]Signet of Devotion[/skill][skill]Blessed Signet[/skill][skill]Succor[/skill][skill]Offering of Blood[/skill][skill]Resurrect[/skill] 2 OPTIONALS

Suggested optionals:
Condition/Hex removal
Blood Ritual (to help maintain energy on the support monk)

Support/Healer Monk
Mo/E
16 Divine Favor
15 Healing Prayers
Very high Sunspear Rank
+20% enchant weapon
All Radiant Insignias/Attunement runes (this is optional, but makes things easier)

[skill]Glyph of Renewal[/skill][skill]Blessed Aura[/skill][skill]Resurrect[/skill][skill]Glyph of Lesser Energy[/skill][skill]Heal Party[/skill] 2 OPTIONALS

Suggested Optionals:
Signet of Devotion
Hex/Condition Removal

Usage:

Main Bonder
Cast balthazar's spirit on yourself
Cast Succor on support monk
Cast life bond on everyone but yourself and the support monk
Maintain bonds using signets and offering of blood.
Use signet of devotion for emergency healing

Support Monk:
Cast Blessed Aura on yourself
When everyone aggros and their health starts getting low, cast glyph of renewal, then seed of life. When seed of life goes down, cast glyph of lesser energy, then heal party as needed. As soon as glyph of renewal recharges, (if needed) recast seed of life. Repeat until there's no bad guys left alive.

Now.....everyone but the 2 monks can rush into just about any battle. The two monks can both stay very far away from the battle since there is no direct healing. Damage to everyone is reduced by half. Once the party starts to get low on health, the support monk casts Glyph of renewal, then Seed of Life on the main bonder. For 8 seconds (or so) any time ANYONE in the party takes damage, EVERYONE in the party is healed for 32 health. Needless to say, this ends up doing some SERIOUS healing. There is only 7 seconds of downtime between casts of Seed of Life with this method. This is why we also bring Glyph of Lesser Energy to spam Heal Party for that 7 seconds. There are also a few emergency heal spells built in.

Also, it works even if a party member has his enchants stripped. As long as other party members are taking damage, that one is still healed along with everyone else.

As i said, i'm farming sunspear points with my monk so i can try this myself. If any testers would like to give it a try, i would appreciate the feedback.

Another thread worth viewing:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10260043

Songbringer · Mar 03, 2008, 04:36 AM // 04:36

Suggestion if you want one. Take Mantra of Signets and use it before blessed signet(i am assuming thats why you have keystone in for. You want insta recharge on blessed signet.) That way blessed still gets recharged instantly and you can bring an elite SoD or SoR or ZB. Mantra of Signets has the same recharge as Keystone so its not like you are losing anything but that Signet of Devo won't get recharged. However your one mantra should be enough to sustain it. You would also be able to keep up mantra of persistance all the time as well. Recharge is 20 and Mantra of Signets is 30 so Persistence would be recharged by the time you an use the other one again.(Incase you were going to say can't have 2 stances up) Only downfall is the 15e Mantra of Signets costs.

Dr Dimento · Mar 03, 2008, 04:47 AM // 04:47

Good suggestion. I did look at mantra of signets, but the high cost would be prohibitive. The only reason we're using anything at all is to make Blessed Signet recharge faster. Using that method you only end up net gaining about 9 energy from blessed signet with divine favor 15. I'm just not sure that will be enough to pay for the upkeep on 8 bonds....though it sounds close (another reason i'm asking for testers). Definitely worth it if it works and allows you to bring ZB tho.

Coloneh · Mar 03, 2008, 06:43 AM // 06:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yichi

at what point in the game do you honestly need 2 bonders... let alone even 1...

read build plz. it replaces the need for a healing backline.

decent idea. im suprized i havent seen it before. the one big problem i see is that you have some intense healing, but no condition or hex removal. your troops will be alive, but can they do anything?

also find a better elite for that monk, if its energy management your looking for try Mantra of Recall, possibly even the new Offering of Blood.

Racthoh · Mar 03, 2008, 06:45 AM // 06:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Dimento

To get an idea of the healing.. Lets say all 6 non-monk party members get hit with an AoE that does 50 damage each second. 6 x 32 = 192. Since damage is reduced by half, each player takes 25 damage, but is healed for 192 health. This results in every player in the AoE being healed for 167 health each second.....and the 2 monks being healed for 192 every second....yikes. Lets assume the AoE only lasts 5 seconds (or you dont have max sunspear rank and your SoL only lasts 5 seconds). For 10 energy, you just did 1,536hp worth of healing in 5 seconds.

Life Bond only triggers on attack damage, any damage from a spell will heal for nothing.

WitTex · Mar 03, 2008, 07:24 AM // 07:24

Can I take this builds for hero, with the same effects?

UPDATE:
It's not actually.

System_Crush · Mar 03, 2008, 09:30 AM // 09:30

If you have a bonder that needs an energy gaining elite take [skill=text]Defender's Zeal[/skill].
[skill=text]Blessed Signet[/skill] is fine for keeping up your bonds out of combat, zeal will give you hoards of energy, if you use it correctly while in combat.

Dr Dimento · Mar 03, 2008, 02:00 PM // 14:00

All suggestions/questions/criticisms replied to...thanks for the input.

Quote:

at what point in the game do you honestly need 2 bonders... let alone even 1...

Having these 2 will allow you to:

1) Forego a vulnerable healing backline
2) "Rush" into battles, as opposed to slow tanking
3) Allow both your monks to stay veeeeeeery far away from combat
4) Heal your entire party, regardless of range, for massive amounts quickly

Quote:

Can I take this builds for hero, with the same effects?

Yes, as long as you're the support monk and your hero the bonder.

Quote:

Life Bond only triggers on attack damage, any damage from a spell will heal for nothing.

Yep, you're right. I adjusted the builds a bit. It was a bad example i guess....

Quote:

one big problem i see is that you have some intense healing, but no condition or hex removal. your troops will be alive, but can they do anything?

EDIT: With 2 optional slots per monk, there is plenty of room for condition/hex removal. Also, with the addition of heal party/glyph of lesser energy, the party can be healed significantly while out of combat.

Quote:

If you have a bonder that needs an energy gaining elite take Defender's Zeal

To use defender's zeal, the bonder would have to go into aggro range of an enemy. Even though he would only be there briefly, it adds alot of risk to the whole concept.

Quote:

also find a better elite for that monk, if its energy management your looking for try Mantra of Recall, possibly even the new Offering of Blood.

I hadn't noticed that sexy change to Offering of Blood. 1 energy.... That does change things a bit. Since the bonder can easily counter the health sacrifice with signet of devotion, it is definitely a preferable alternative. Combined with blessed signet, energy should never be a problem.... It also saves us 2 skill slots on the bonder.....since you wont be needing Balthazar's spirit, or keystone signet/mantra.

Div · Mar 03, 2008, 02:01 PM // 14:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

Life Bond only triggers on attack damage, any damage from a spell will heal for nothing.

That will be the biggest problem of this build. If you face areas with strong casters (like many in EotN), you'll notice that your team gets 2-shotted to death and your monks have no ability to prot against it or heal it back up effectively. Dual bonders can seem to work alright for areas where there are a lot of soft-hitting physicals though.

Dr Dimento · Mar 03, 2008, 03:33 PM // 15:33

Quote:

That will be the biggest problem of this build. If you face areas with strong casters (like many in EotN), you'll notice that your team gets 2-shotted to death and your monks have no ability to prot against it or heal it back up

Agreed. I've incorporated a few of the suggestions that were made. Now that both monks have 2 optional slots, it should work better in areas with mostly casters. However, as long as there is alot of aggro, a team should easily be able to overcome....since any single attack on a party member results in EVERYONE being healed for 32 hp. As long as no one party member is taking all the damage (a tank for instance), this should heal everyone super quick.

Also threw in GoLE and Heal Party for relatively cheap range unlimited whole party healing to help get through the caster heavy areas.

Another viable strategy is to have an ob flesh tank aggro a separate group while maintaining ob flesh. If that group has 3 or 4 enemies, every party member will be healed for about 100 - 120hp every second or so. Pretty sure the other 5 party members could handle themselves with that type of healing going on. This would work extremely well in the FoW.

Jaigoda · Mar 03, 2008, 04:01 PM // 16:01

IMO, a better idea would be something like this:

[skill]Life Bond[/skill][skill]Balthazar's Spirit[/skill][skill]Blessed Aura[/skill][skill]Blessed Signet[/skill][skill]Mantra of Inscriptions[/skill][skill]Glyph of Renewal[/skill][skill]Seed of Life[/skill][skill]Extinguish[/skill]

[skill]Blessed Aura[/skill][skill]Glyph of Renewal[/skill][skill]Seed of Life[/skill][skill]Reversal of Fortune[/skill][skill]Shield of Absorption[/skill][skill]Spirit Bond[/skill][skill]Cure Hex[/skill][skill]Glyph of Lesser Energy[/skill]

The bonder should be able to manage its energy and still cast GoR+SoL so long as people take about 1-2 hits per second. With this, you can keep SoL up near-constantly, which means something very close to godmode (imagine this with an imbagon...). Your only threat is high-damage spells, which Spirit Bond is able to handle fairly effectively, especially considering it'll get healed back up by SoL in a few seconds. What do you guys think?

Chthon · Mar 03, 2008, 04:53 PM // 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaigoda

IMO, a better idea would be something like this:

[skill]Life Bond[/skill][skill]Balthazar's Spirit[/skill][skill]Blessed Aura[/skill][skill]Blessed Signet[/skill][skill]Mantra of Inscriptions[/skill][skill]Glyph of Renewal[/skill][skill]Seed of Life[/skill][skill]Extinguish[/skill]

[skill]Blessed Aura[/skill][skill]Glyph of Renewal[/skill][skill]Seed of Life[/skill][skill]Reversal of Fortune[/skill][skill]Shield of Absorption[/skill][skill]Spirit Bond[/skill][skill]Cure Hex[/skill][skill]Glyph of Lesser Energy[/skill]

The bonder should be able to manage its energy and still cast GoR+SoL so long as people take about 1-2 hits per second. With this, you can keep SoL up near-constantly, which means something very close to godmode (imagine this with an imbagon...). Your only threat is high-damage spells, which Spirit Bond is able to handle fairly effectively, especially considering it'll get healed back up by SoL in a few seconds. What do you guys think?

Whom exactly is the bonder supposed to seed?

fainty · Mar 03, 2008, 05:58 PM // 17:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaigoda

[skill]Life Bond[/skill][skill]Balthazar's Spirit[/skill][skill]Blessed Aura[/skill][skill]Blessed Signet[/skill][skill]Mantra of Inscriptions[/skill][skill]Glyph of Renewal[/skill][skill]Seed of Life[/skill][skill]Extinguish[/skill]

Able to give me this template, so i can use this Mo/Me/E ingame. but with some other skills around what are a bit more usefull for active play.

Jaigoda · Mar 03, 2008, 06:55 PM // 18:55

What can I say, I made it in like 5 minutes. Could have sworn SoL was target ally, though... Whatever, just bring two hybrids and you're golden.

Dr Dimento · Mar 03, 2008, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Quote:

Whom exactly is the bonder supposed to seed?

That got me to thinking...... If there were 2 different bonders with identical Mo/E builds, and both of them cast life bond on the 6 non-monk party members.... The 2 monks could actually maintain Seed of Life pretty easily. Also, since they'll always be targeting (only) one another, it will be easy "taking turns" casting SoL since you'll see them cast, and can time it.

EDIT:
I just tested this in game and it works. Damage IS redirected to BOTH monks, so SoL does trigger on both monks in this fashion. It is not clear if the damage reduction stacks or not, but balthazar's Spirit also triggers in this fashion on both monks when 1 party member takes damage. Now the only issue would be energy management and hex/condition removal. Since the max SoL time is about 8 seconds after buffs, and you have 2 monks with it.....SoL can actually be...no strings attached, maintained.

Burst Cancel · Mar 05, 2008, 01:58 AM // 01:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

decent idea. im suprized i havent seen it before.

Am I missing something? People have been running the SoL + Life Bond thing for months and months.

Bonder teams are fine and everything, but what are you using as cover enchantments for those bonds? Last time I checked, strips in PvE are not uncommon. You've also devoted two party slots to characters who are only really effective against physicals - any kind of massed caster presence is going to destroy you.

Overall, I'd say midline defense (e.g., wards, enfeebling blood, disruption, etc.) combined with standard monks is both more versatile and more resilient.

Mr Pink57 · Mar 05, 2008, 05:50 AM // 05:50

Stripping is huge in PvE especially GWEN and later parts of NF. Also all elite missions I believe have some sort of enchant stripping along with FoW and UW. I have never been a fan of the bonder, its a poor spot on the team and is relied so heavily upon that it can make or break the team (the other monk usually just goes full heal which scares me).

For what two monks can achieve on bonding I think one necro with Enfeebling Blood can achieve just as easily. Or the ever broken Imbagon who can also provide a serious amount of damage on top of it.

pink

Racthoh · Mar 05, 2008, 07:20 AM // 07:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Pink57

Stripping is huge in PvE especially GWEN and later parts of NF. Also all elite missions I believe have some sort of enchant stripping along with FoW and UW.

A good 85-90% of the mobs in FoW have enchantment removal or Nature's Renewal will reach to you. UW isn't a problem really as you can run right past all of the Nature's Renewal there; Shatters present on the Chaos Plains and Rend from in the Bone Pits.

Chthon · Mar 05, 2008, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

any kind of massed caster presence is going to destroy you.

It might be amusing to go up to 3 monks and pack protective bond on all 3 so that the energy loss was reduced to 1 each. That should slow spell damage down enough that seed triggering off wand shots should overtake it.

As for getting stripped, IDK. Perhaps monks could cover adequately to keep the bonds safe, especially with 3 of them. Maybe run a team of all dervs who are self-covering?

Speaking of dervs... how about VoS? Gee... this is sounding like a team build now. 5 VoS dervs covered with life bond, protective bond, and getting healed through SoL. Toss in a non-spell condition removal (I'm thinking remedy sig, purifying finale + GftE, or plague touch) and it could border on unstoppable. Just steer clear of nature's renewal (anyone know if it activates when the enchanter or the enchantee enters its range?) and the small handful of non-spell enchant strips and you're golden. Lol call it "Chthon-way."

Pyro maniac · Mar 05, 2008, 05:25 PM // 17:25

[skill]Angelic Bond[/skill] + Seed of Life is pretty common